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IT'S NOT MUELLER TIME!

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https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/byron-york-if-mueller-didnt-charge-flynn-and-manafort-with-collusion-then-who-was-colluding

If Mueller didn't charge Flynn and Manafort with collusion, then who was colluding?

Trump-Russia special counsel Robert Mueller is authorized to investigate "any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump." The popular word for that is collusion, and it remains at the heart of both the Mueller and the Senate Intelligence Committee investigations. (Majority Republicans on the House Intelligence Committee recently announced they were unable to find evidence proving collusion.)

While much about the Mueller investigation remains unknown, we do know the indictments he has filed and the pleas he has reached with various figures in the case. There are some, including charges against Russia's Internet Research Agency, several individual Russians, and two minor figures, that target either people on the Russian side of the equation or those for whom there are no suspicions of collusion.

But Mueller has charged three people who were in the Trump campaign inner circle -- former national security adviser Michael Flynn, former campaign chairman Paul Manafort, and former deputy campaign chairman Richard Gates, all with ties to Russia and all of whom might be expected to be part of a collusion scheme, had one existed. Mueller has also charged one peripheral hanger-on, George Papadopoulos, who might conceivably have been part of a collusion scenario.

But all have faced charges and none of those charges, at least so far, has involved allegations that Flynn, Manafort, Gates, or Papadapoulos played a role in a scheme of collusion, or coordination, or conspiracy, or whatever it is called. And that could tell the public something about the state of the collusion allegation inside the Mueller investigation.

To put it briefly: What kind of collusion scheme between Russia and the Trump campaign could have existed without Michael Flynn being part of it? What kind of collusion scheme could have existed without Manafort? And Gates? And yet none of them -- nor Papadapoulos, either -- has been charged with taking part in a collusion scheme.

Flynn pleaded guilty to one count of lying to investigators about what he discussed in a phone conversation with Russian ambassador Sergey Kislyak. (Investigators have always known what the two men talked about, since the call was wiretapped, recorded, and transcribed.)

Manafort has been charged with a daunting number of financial crimes, including fraud and tax evasion, relating to his work for a pro-Russian political party in Ukraine.

Gates was charged with most of the crimes Manafort faced, but received a deal from Mueller, allowing him to plead guilty to one count of lying to investigators and one count of hiding profits from his work with Manafort in Ukraine.

Both Gates and Manafort were charged with something called "conspiracy against the United States." As the former prosecutor Andrew McCarthy points out, "there is no such offense in federal law as 'conspiracy against the United States.'" But Mueller's office described their alleged crimes that way, and some media commentators liked the treason-ish sound of the phrase.

Papadopoulos pleaded guilty to one count of lying to investigators about a conversation he had with a Russian who wanted to create ties with the Trump campaign.

All those charges, and none alleging that any of these men, some of them at the highest levels of the Trump campaign, took part in any collusion, or coordination, or conspiracy between the campaign and Russia.

"I can't imagine that there would have been collusion or conspiracy with the Russians that Michael Flynn didn't know about," said Sol Wisenberg, a former prosecutor with the office of independent counsel Kenneth Starr. "If you're trying to make a collusion case and you are Mueller, you're trying to get someone to plead to the crime you're trying to prove."

McCarthy has written much the same. "When a prosecutor has a cooperator who was an accomplice in a major criminal scheme, the cooperator is made to plead guilty to the scheme," he wrote last December. "This is critical because it proves the existence of the scheme."

 

Even Preet Bharara, the New York U.S. attorney fired by Trump and no fan of the president's, said last year, "When we had evidence against somebody and wanted them to flip, we made them plead guilty to every bad act that they had ever done, especially if we were later going to be alleging other people had engaged in that activity as well."

But in the Mueller investigation, it is precisely the people who would most be expected to be part of a collusion scheme who have not been charged with taking part in any such activity.

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This 'investigation' won't end until they find something, anything on Trump or he is out of office. I believe this was their plan all along, the ruling elite weren't going down without fight.

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God Dayum it's fun pissing off Right Wing Idiots! tenor.gif?itemid=4872552

 

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8 minutes ago, DD: OG said:

This 'investigation' won't end until they find something, anything on Trump or he is out of office. I believe this was their plan all along, the ruling elite weren't going down without fight.

What I'm most concerned about is the effect of an ongoing "investigation" on future elections, namely later this year and heaven forbid in 2020, if it extends out that far. 

Just think, there could/will be absolutely nothing found and all this time that they were investigating said nothing, voters were being swayed under the illusion of collusion.  And by the time that Mueller delivers his final verdict, votes will have already been cast and asses will have filled seats. You can't take those results back.

What kind of world do we live in where false accusations can be made and propelled by the media to the point where the general public begins to accept them as truth and hence, decide to vote on what they believe is the right thing to do when in reality the opposite were true?

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2 hours ago, facelessman07 said:

What I'm most concerned about is the effect of an ongoing "investigation" on future elections, namely later this year and heaven forbid in 2020, if it extends out that far. 

Just think, there could/will be absolutely nothing found and all this time that they were investigating said nothing, voters were being swayed under the illusion of collusion.  And by the time that Mueller delivers his final verdict, votes will have already been cast and asses will have filled seats. You can't take those results back.

What kind of world do we live in where false accusations can be made and propelled by the media to the point where the general public begins to accept them as truth and hence, decide to vote on what they believe is the right thing to do when in reality the opposite were true?

You just described the concept of "The Big Lie".

They know exactly what they are doing.  This is all premeditated calculation and purpose.

We're literally in the middle of a War of Truth, with a right vs wrong agenda/future at stake.

It's as starkly black and white as that.

One leads us down a path of totalitarianism, statism, and ultimately destruction of our society and way of life, and the other leads us to continual freedom, liberty, and prosperity.

 

And then think about this...

One side literally can't ever solve problems.  They only survive because there are problems for them to claim to champion.  They need problems to persist.  They have a built in conflict of interest in this regard.  If they solved problems, this would elevate the afflicted voters into a non-afflicted category that no longer needs a champion because the cause no longer exists.  So all this side ever really does is act like they will solve the problems, but they never really do.  They only ever help just enough to give the appearance that they are giving effort to champion the cause.

And the vast majority of the MSM is ON THIS SIDE.

 

Just imagine if there weren't a political ideology that derived all it's power from the existence of problems and voters afflicted by those problems.

Imagine if the only political ideology that existed was the one who's job it was to maintain freedom, liberty, and prosperity for all, and prevent anything devolving into an affliction for anyone.

Only one of our political systems has the power to be like this.   The other one simply can't.

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1 hour ago, Beef said:

You just described the concept of "The Big Lie".

They know exactly what they are doing.  This is all premeditated calculation and purpose.

We're literally in the middle of a War of Truth, with a right vs wrong agenda/future at stake.

So how exactly are we supposed to rectify this problem?

I don't see a "one size" answer to fix a broken system that has been gradually building for decades.

Especially when this system is continually parading itself around to others, credulous as can be, as a beacon of integrity and freedom.

It's just a barrage of facile arguments, one after another, and the public gives its full support under false assumptions. Think of jb, dude is a fucking idiot but actually and genuinely BELIEVES what he's doing is right. And even when shown to be wrong, their pride will not allow them to think otherwise because they have so much effort equity already built into this zeitgeist.

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38 minutes ago, facelessman07 said:

So how exactly are we supposed to rectify this problem?

I don't see a "one size" answer to fix a broken system that has been gradually building for decades.

Especially when this system is continually parading itself around to others, credulous as can be, as a beacon of integrity and freedom.

It's just a barrage of facile arguments, one after another, and the public gives its full support under false assumptions. Think of jb, dude is a fucking idiot but actually BELIEVES what he's doing is right.

I don't know, man.  Trump is just a stop-gap delay in the Collectivist agenda, me thinks.

After seeing how insane the Establishment and the Left have come after him, who the fuck is going to want to subject themselves to what he's being put through?

The only chance we have is if he's able to completely prevail by sending us into an economic bliss that nobody can spin, and if he's totally vindicated and the truth behind this attempted coup and all it's corruption and lies are exposed, and the perpetrators receive due justice.

 

Right now, the Establishment Republicans are stuck between Trump being a threat to them more than a blessing.  If Trump had his way, the Establishment would be wiped out on both sides.  Congressional term limits, huge reforms that totally fuck the donor class, monopolies, and Collectivists, total energy independence, global fair trade, illegals fucking all gone.

I mean there is a way to fix it all, but the forces working against it are monumental hurdles that I just don't know if they can be overcome.  And even if he were to prevail, is the next guy to step up going to have his spine and fortitude and be on the same page with an agenda he won't exploit or sell to the Establishment and the fucking donor class?

I don't know, man.  I do all I can do and still feel pretty powerless.  I donate a lot of money.  I constantly write my Senators and Representatives, local, state, and federal.  I participate on several message boards.  I do gobs of research to make sure I'm forming proper ideas and beliefs.  I study economics and the markets intently and use this all to even educate my clients so they can grasp how our elected officials effect their finances.  I educate my kids in the same way.  My oldest daughter is majoring in political science and is going to be an attorney likely in contract and patent law, maybe even get involved in politics.

I don't know what else to fucking do.  I want to be optimistic because that's just who I am by nature, but fuck me, man, our country is so insane right now.  And our elected officials, for the most part, are just horrible goddamn human beings.  And the people voting for many of them are so inept and ignorant, it's just beyond frustrating and sad.

It's like how is everyone not on the same page with a system that works when it's done right?  And how do we know which system works right?  It's the one that doesn't rely on the worst of our society to have an ounce of power.

And I'm not even saying that this best system even exists and is a choice right now.  It's really not.  There's a fucked up wrong side, and then there's a broken as fuck side.  That's our two choices right now.  And the best path is to jump on board with the broken as fuck system and then everyone work together to fix it.

At this point, I guess we just see if Trump can somehow prevail and slowly but surely get us on that path.  And then pray the next person we get in there can/will continue it.

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5 hours ago, DD: OG said:

This 'investigation' won't end until they find something, anything on Trump or he is out of office. I believe this was their plan all along, the ruling elite weren't going down without fight.

 

Well, exactly...ghostly forces are swarming and attempting to make a " magic moment " ....and actually succeeding at " draining the swamp " would require a bloodbath of epic proportions......

Dafk ? ......:(

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If an entire force of motivated people try hard enough to find dirt on anyone, they'll likely do so. In this case we're talking about an extremely successful and wealthy American with global interests. 

What we are watching here is a Democratic witch-hunt because they absolutely can't comprehend the lose of the 2016 Presidental election.

What Trump should have done was immediately counter with an exact witch-hunt aimed at Hillary Clinton.

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